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Post by frankie on Dec 14, 2011 23:24:16 GMT
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Post by vincentvaughan on Dec 15, 2011 4:07:04 GMT
Hello Guys n Dolls
I have one of the helicon G XT units.
Haven't gigged it yet trying to get my head around the idea of using it live.......
Some of the earlier ones in a reasonable price range that I have seen all need to have the key set for each song.
Have heard a few others using different types out playing live but they all seemed to over use them, no thought process regarding where a bit of harmony should fit into a song etc, after a few songs it all began to sound plastic and boring.
Even heard a few using them who obviously didn't set the correct key for the song they were singing so the harmonies were completely out of key and it all sounded complete crap......
funny thing was the singers seemed completely oblivious to just how crap they sounded, even had that look on their face that said 'I think I'm fecking deadly'........
Pity because I think if a harmoniser was used effectively in the right place it could be a great addition......but unfortunately its part of what gives technology a bad name for those of us who actually care about the effort we put in...........
The tc helicon g xt unit that I have certainly is very good from the 'fooling around' Ive done with it at home...plug your guitar in and play a song, it will track perfectly good Harmony's with your vocal. the pre sets appear to be very good with out any messing around with settings, so instant gratification....
A small amount of auto tune is effective as a vocal effect...........Michael Buble uses it to get that 'effect' you hear on some of his songs.
Excellent feature on it which will automatically balance the guitar volume with your vocal, so one never gets louder than the other, as soon as you come off the vocal for a lead break on guitar, the guitar level appears to rise loud enough with out adjustment.
One of the things I did discovered is that it doesn't need to be a guitar thats plugged in........you can pass a feed from your backing track/midi file player through it and it will follow the key perfectly, so all you need to do is press the foot switch to kick in or out the harmony.neat for non guitar players..........
A feature it has which automatically appears to adjust eq within itself for the best vocal sound for your voice / microphone combination......takes about 20 seconds to do it when you start singing first.........nice natural reverbs also...........
thats my bit for today.........think it could be a good thing, but to use it well, I think subtlety, is that how you spell it? is the answer.........
Plan out your song in so far as where a harmony line should be in the song as if a second singer was in the band doing what he/she should be doing.
Almost instant gratification if you try doing an Everly bros song like dream dream or Marty Robbins Elpaso....on the 'one night a wild young cowboy rode in' bit...........
but it would be so easy to over do it.........if you are lucky enough to be playing to an audience who actually care and are listening...........it might be an idea to introduce it to them in a fun way, like saying you are embracing technology........that way your being up front and they might appreciate it, instead of just ploughing on regardless hoping they wont notice that your a 50 year old male singer sounding like Enya..........once that happens I think its fair to say, you've lost the plot.
Anyway Ive blabbed on enough for now.........would suggest if you get an opportunity to try one and give it some time you might find something new for your sound which would give you a new lease of life..........I got mine from thomann, €194 once I got the VAT back......as far as I can remember, If you didnt like what you buy from them you can send it back, so basically you can try it out in your own home for a week or so, for the cost of the postage......might be worth a shot.............
Cheers
Vince
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Post by frankie on Dec 15, 2011 6:30:29 GMT
When using in note mode write the harmony in on piano scroll in cakewalk. I always make the note a little longer so it doesnt stop with the main vocal track.
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Post by weeo on Dec 15, 2011 10:00:45 GMT
Thanks Vincent, and Frank, that's the information i was looking for.
I'm sure there is one out there that works with voice only and no programming. Maybe i picked up some duff info.
The search goes on.
Eddie
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Post by vincentvaughan on Dec 15, 2011 17:00:31 GMT
Hello Eddie
I have a digitech one here that works with voice only but you must select the key.
Its called a digitech vocalist performer, been about quiet a while so should be cheap on ebay
Nice small size, about 6 inches by six inches square and very light, easy to work controls, should have a foot pedal controller with it with 3 foot switches and a jack to jack cable which is wired to A/B between types and to mute the effects if so wished. sounds pretty good, the only down side I see with it is have to manually select the key.........
I got a loan of it to try from a friend.
Might be worth having a look for one second hand, cant be much more than 70/80 pounnds.
The only reason I thought I might try the tc helicon was that it gives hands off operation which I needed as a guitar player..........it is a great unit for the money, though as I said in my previous post, Im still playing head games with myself as to whether my audiences or myself for that matter would accept it.
Take it easy
Vincent
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Post by Tubbs on Dec 15, 2011 19:46:33 GMT
Ya me neither .. had 3 of them over the years each time with the best of intentions had no probs setting them up and using them but never felt comfortable with them ....a lot of the one man bands are using them down here but def not for me anyway Barry  I was the same using midi files,but ya gotta,"go with the flow to get the dough" I do a lot of Bobby Vee.Neil Sedaka,Gene Pitney,Big O.Most of their material was double tracked. How bland is Pretty Woman without the harmony in the bridge !! I dont want to go singing cowboy songs lol. You could also use a cardboard cut out to stand next to you. My 2c worth now I will sit and wait for the flaming lol. I have nothing against other people using them....they are just not for me Frankie....i actually do have a cardboard cut out next to me though, its of the mother-in-law, just in case things get rowdy!!  |
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Post by frankie on Dec 15, 2011 20:51:15 GMT
Hello Eddie I have a digitech one here that works with voice only but you must select the key. Its called a digitech vocalist performer, been about quiet a while so should be cheap on ebay Nice small size, about 6 inches by six inches square and very light, easy to work controls, should have a foot pedal controller with it with 3 foot switches and a jack to jack cable which is wired to A/B between types and to mute the effects if so wished. sounds pretty good, the only down side I see with it is have to manually select the key......... I got a loan of it to try from a friend. Might be worth having a look for one second hand, cant be much more than 70/80 pounnds. The only reason I thought I might try the tc helicon was that it gives hands off operation which I needed as a guitar player..........it is a great unit for the money, though as I said in my previous post, Im still playing head games with myself as to whether my audiences or myself for that matter would accept it. Take it easy Vincent What happens when you change key or go up in semi-tones as in Mack The Knife ? |
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Post by frankie on Dec 15, 2011 21:21:47 GMT
I think you can use it in chord mode via the chords played on a midi file.I am not sure if there is one that is controlled by voice alone unless you want to sing "A Horse With No Name" all night lol
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Post by weeo on Dec 15, 2011 23:48:28 GMT
very interesting comments guys and thanks for all help / input
I'll let you know the outcome
Eddie
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Post by vincentvaughan on Dec 16, 2011 17:14:58 GMT
Hi guys
The debate goes on..............he he he
just tried my tc helicon xt with a midi backing track...........delibrately put 4 key changes in semi tones in it, no guide.........just drums bass and piano..............it triggers the key changes for the harmonys perfectly..........even muted the piano track, so the only musical notes were the bass line..........again key changes for each semi tone were bang on.....
The unit allows you to have your voice doubled with one click of the foot pedal, add one harmony with another single click, then 3 and 5 part and so on if you so wish...........so the user selects exactly what harmony he/she desires during the performance with a simple press of the foot switch.............not sure what more any one could want............it works great
I still havent convinced myself about using it live yet though
Any way
Happy Christmas and all that jazzzzzz
Vincent
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Post by frankie on Dec 16, 2011 21:39:55 GMT
Hi guys The debate goes on..............he he he just tried my tc helicon xt with a midi backing track...........delibrately put 4 key changes in semi tones in it, no guide.........just drums bass and piano..............it triggers the key changes for the harmonys perfectly..........even muted the piano track, so the only musical notes were the bass line..........again key changes for each semi tone were bang on..... The unit allows you to have your voice doubled with one click of the foot pedal, add one harmony with another single click, then 3 and 5 part and so on if you so wish...........so the user selects exactly what harmony he/she desires during the performance with a simple press of the foot switch.............not sure what more any one could want............it works great I still havent convinced myself about using it live yet though Any way Happy Christmas and all that jazzzzzz Vincent Use it live in a couple of songs to start with and see what the comments are. |
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Post by JC on Dec 17, 2011 1:52:51 GMT
I use a Vocal Harmoniser, I found the trick is to be very subtle with it, it's great for doing oohs and ahhs behind another singer, sounds like The Jordanaires :-)
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Post by steveb on Dec 17, 2011 4:37:56 GMT
I use the DigiTech Vocalist and after I found out how to fine tune it the result was worth the effort. Now I fine that I can't work without it.
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