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Post by steveb on Apr 25, 2011 2:29:30 GMT
Hi everyone, This is a good forum with some great, enthusiastic and very helpful members. I want to highlight that the people like John G and all the moderators etc are what makes this forum what it is.....however, it is "Midi Files" that this forum basis it's self on, but it doesn't have a members only area to access Midi Files...only by way of a request and then an email delivery system. I know I have been down this track before and I know I will receive the same responses as before, but you ask what you can do to Re-invigorate the forum. this will always be my response.
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Post by JohnG on Apr 25, 2011 7:43:32 GMT
You make a fair point Steve,
And that section is the most active of the forum.
But unless someone is prepared to check every incoming file and create a resource for accessing them, then we are in the same dilemma. And, I'm sorry, but I'm not volunteering for that task for a variety of reasons.
All the best, JohnG.
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Post by freeway on Apr 25, 2011 10:28:03 GMT
I have to agree with Steve on this one and have also suggested in the past a midi file libraray as before . Activity has been in decline since we lost our midi files and we know who's responsible for that .....but moving on from that Ive been involved in Freshmidis for over 6 years now and we went through something similar with members posting copywritten files and we were forced into closure for a period of time . But the difference in FM being there was never any intention of deceiving or profiting from the midis it was just the naivity and stupidity of some members that caused it all. Right now we got about 5 mods who check nearly every incoming file admittedly the odd one escapes every now and then but if a CR is found they are removed instantly . I realise and totally understand the problems and work involved in checking all these files its quite impossible really but we do it to the best of our ability .....to really eradicate these midis we'd need sophisticated and expensive software which Im sure our Admin has no intention of forking out on ;D Anyway Midihangout has probably made its mind up on this issue but I think Steve has a point and its definately one of the reasons for the decline in activity. Regards Barry
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Post by Tubbs on Apr 25, 2011 13:30:49 GMT
But unless someone is prepared to check every incoming file and create a resource for accessing them, then we are in the same dilemma. Quite right John....and you do more than your fair share with your tutorials and technical queries. So it begs the question....any members want to volunteer? We would all love an easy access midi library but this requires the participation of any members prepared to help...its not just admin and staff that make a forum.
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Post by freeway on Apr 25, 2011 14:42:54 GMT
I for one would gladly help out Barry
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Post by Tubbs on Apr 25, 2011 15:57:47 GMT
Well....i certainly think its worth looking in to...and any ideas as to whats involved in setting it up would be greatly appreciated....i wouldnt know where to start..
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Post by JohnG on Apr 25, 2011 16:34:43 GMT
Well, for a start we need a web site to store them. There are some very cheap or even cost free sites. A little research needs to be done here.
My suggestion would be that access be provided by password which would only be distributed to forum members of course. So the site needs to implement a security feature. This is how similar sites work. An administrator would issue the password to those who ask via PM. The password should be changed on a moderately regular basis and the fact that it had been changed would be announced on the forum.
Members could submit MIDI files but they would have to have their source included, embedded within them. Any files with no provenance get chucked out ... too risky. Those that get included are from known people who freely distribute their MIDIs into the public domain.
You need someone who has the software to be able to check the files as they come in. They must have genuine copyright data included within them. If you do that you'll be safe.
Then the site could have alphabetical or genre lists or whatever suits people. The person that controls it would need some HTML skills I'm guessing to get the layout right. It doesn't need to be too complex tho' in fact simple is probably best.
Just a few thoughts. As usual ... JohnG.
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Post by Tubbs on Apr 25, 2011 17:08:09 GMT
Excellent John....and thanks......a bit of research needs to be done now to see how we can proceed with it so the more suggestions and ideas we can throw in the pot the better..
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Post by geraint on Apr 25, 2011 17:55:13 GMT
Its a great idea in principal, but if we cast our minds back, the files which we were all duped into believing were ok to share, had the copyright removed from them, this could still be an issue.
As you may recall, I offered a database of my Midi Files, (which is still not completed as it comes to thousands) to any member. I think I had four takers.
If we all did this, we would know who had a file which we may need.
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Post by Tubbs on Apr 25, 2011 18:11:14 GMT
I know where you are coming from Geraint....it would require very close scrutiny...but if it is possible it would be good to have an A to Z facility if searching for one specific file....as was proved at MM before it came to light about what Glenn was doing....if policed in a proper manner and everything kept in line with the law it would benefit the forum massively because even though we had no choice but to seperate ourselves from Glenns lies...the formula (the forum being attached to a midi library) was a winning combination. Sadly, if we dont do something to generate more membership i feel this forum will just eventually fold, and thats the sad truth.
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Post by Jacqui on Apr 26, 2011 4:08:45 GMT
It seems to me that to keep an on board database of available midis, will be a lot of work for admin and there is always going to be the copyright issue, unless there were more people to share does it really warrant it, in the beginning although we had Glenn's/ files available, which was great, but as it turned out not legal, we've always had the request side too, and it seems to work OK in my opinion, in the early days, we had loads of scope for discussions, as every subject was a new one, a bit like a new date, but I can't think of much we've not talked about now, if you look back over the years, we have sure had a lot of interesting subjects covered here, and I'm sure we will continue to.... when would everyone say was our most active, interesting time? was it when Glenn got found out, that certainly stirred a lot of interest, the lovely Jazzcat was around then, and always liked to voice an opinion, was it when Shyam was here more, if I remember rightly, he got in trouble many a time because of speaking out honestly, so is that what we are looking for I've not noticed Fresh Midis has a great deal of activity apart from the midis on there, but maybe I'm missing it would there be a way to link up with FM somehow or is that out of the question, might solve the database issue, and generate some new members. I think an email to all old members might be an idea, you know the saying Out Of Site Out Of Mind, it might jog a few memories to pay us a visit again. Jacqui
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Post by JohnG on Apr 26, 2011 7:40:14 GMT
Except that FreshMidis account is now suspended. Could that be due to a copyright infringement, I wonder?
Making the database for private access may get round that problem. And you're right Jacqui, it is a good deal of work for someone to do.
I think a bit of research into free, or very low cost web hosting sites, that would support a closed user group, may be worthwhile. If something suitable exists then look into how we would present the files.
My own preference would be only to offer files to those people who participate a bit or who offer something special to the group. So maybe a probationary period where people have to post 10 times and not just "I agree" or "me too" posts. But then I'm a meanie!
JohnG.
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Post by freeway on Apr 26, 2011 8:58:01 GMT
Well at least Steve's got the ball rolling on this one for sure ;D A couple of points Id like to make on the issue......... As regards a Database I wouldnt have a clue how to go about setting that up myself but Im sure Pat would have some ideas on that one .....as regards the midis themselves I agree with John they need to be checked for Copyright before being allowed into the Database a sort of halway house like before if Im not mistaken......but I dont go along with the idea of only posting files with their scources emebedded in them that way we would letting lots of good quality freely available c/r free midis escape and end up with lots of mediocre files that we can get anywhere on the net. In an ideal world it would be great if there was an easier way to do this but unfor there isnt so if we just post midis that have all their data and scource intact (which are few and far between) in my opinion it won't make much of a library . Freshmidis has lots of good quality midis ok some might argue probably half them have been stripped of their c/r but unless we had the proper software there's no way of us knowing where and when these midis originated. As I said before FM had a c/r issue a few years back but since then we've had no more problems on that score as the Mods and and long standing Members watch every file thats been posted and are removed instantly if found to be in breach of the Forum Guidelines . Our aim here at MH in all this is to attract more members so if we can offer an extensive "C/R" free Midifile Library we can then act upon any reports and remove any offending files . Jacqui I don't think the idea of linking up with FM would be possible for a variety of reasons as well as that not sure whats happening over there right now Account Suspended for now . Two years ago FM had a bout 1500 Members not it has over 6000 but Id say about 5% of them are active if that ...its turned into a request only site so it happens all over not just here. I like the idea also of contacting old members "Out Of Site Out Of Mind " nice one Jacqui. ;D One last thing I also agree with John on allowing only members who have contributed some way or other access to the files and that should include requests as well...... I wouldnt go along with banning or penalising members for not posting as this could be for a variety of reasons whose to know ......also it would be great to incorporate some sort of Repair Centre like over in FM for members who are having probs with their files or need any kind of editing done ......... Sorry for going on a bit but I'd hate to see this site folding like so many others especially with such a nice and friendly bunch here at Midihangout . Regards Barry
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Post by weegeo on Apr 26, 2011 9:09:20 GMT
Gerry says `i feel this forum will just eventually fold, and thats the sad truth.`
This would be a sad blow to all the good folk that do visit here,and Jacqui is absolutely right when she mentions the topics that have gone on before,who could possibly forget the `wooden stool`saga from Shyam that went on for ages lol it`s hard to put ones finger on why we have dropped of so much it seems to me that now we are in danger of becoming a midi request site and i don`t have a problem with that but it would be nice to be more than that again. I`m not gonna knock facebook but there seems to be a lot more going on in there at the minute i do have some good friends from our forum in there as well but my thoughts are always here in the forum.
A data base or library would be an excellent idea a bit tricky to police and to be honest i have the time but not the knowledge to oversee it but i am more than willing to help if i can and maybe we should examine if we can do it or not this however doesn`t open up our topic section eg:chat,sport and so on.
Tutorials I think that huge credo`s should go to all that have the knowledge to put these together,John is amazing when it comes to putting his experience down on paper and whilst [wait for the hammering lol]some of the terms would go over my head.one only has to ask and the old master will break it down for you no problem and i think those of us that would want to become a `techie`should enroll with him now,i can only say `thanx John`. Someone asked where is `jazzcat`i think along with John we kept her very busy we do miss her sharp wit and tongue here with us and it would be great to have her back as a regular i do know she is quite busy with other projects so i don`t know if she will make a `comeback`but i would urge those closer to her to at least point her back in our direction.
Finally to anyone that `ghost`reads this ramble please make a comment on it so we know your alive lol
weegeo ---------------------- in the corner in a reflective mood lol
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Post by JohnG on Apr 26, 2011 9:52:54 GMT
Hi Barry and George, Barry, the point you make about excluding files is a fair one, but the problem is that if a file has no provenance then it could be a commercial file with its c/r removed. If I was having to check the incoming files how the heck do you check it? Take a look at at a few of the commercial sites and see just how many files you need to check against. Any one slipping through the net could get the site closed down. It doesn't stop people exchanging files where the provenance is dubious, far be it for me to suggest that such a terrible thing would ever occur! I did read but forgot to comment on Jacqui's suggestion of sending a blanket e-mail. I too think it might wake some people up. As George says, it would be sad to see the forum die, like him I pop in most every day hoping for some chit chat of some kind. What I think might be useful if people were to describe their MIDI set up, however simple or complex, and maybe what I use at home and what I gig with. Any home built projects like Shyam's little table. Just some ideas. JohnG.
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